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KCCC 28 - Live in Warsaw, June 11th, 2000

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KCCC 28 - Live in Warsaw, June 11th, 2000

Postby Sebastian Knight on Tue Jan 25, 2005 2:10 am

Track List/Times:
1. ProzaKc Blues - 6:09
2. The ContruKction of Light - 8:43
3. Oyster Soup - 7:42
4. Improv: Warsaw - 12:35
5. Dinosaur - 5:27
6. One Time - 5:52
7. VROOOM - 4:46
8. Cage - 5:27
--- disk 2 ---
9. Into the Frying Pan - 6:40
10. Larks IV - 13:54
11. Three of a Perfect Pair - 4:01
12. Deception of the Thrush - 10:18
13. Sex, Sleep, Eat, Drink, Dream - 7:12
14. Heroes - 7:17

First Impressions:
PB and TCOL strike me as no big deal on this recording. Fine, but nothing special. On the other hand, I really like this Oyster Soup. Trey talks about being off-balance in Oyster Soup in the liner notes, but the guitarist are out for blood. Adrian's solo (right before RF's spider fingers thing) is unbelievable, but the guitarists are aggressive throughout. There are moments when this performance sounds like a six-car pile-up, but in a good way. :twisted:

Improv Warsaw: this is the 2000 improv style that starts slow, and then kicks into a funky little groove with nasty little Robert solos towards the end. It's a pretty good example of the genre, similar to some heard on the EWO DVD.

Dinosaur: solid performance. One Time: usually this is a song I don't care for, but the part where the song briefly evanesces into soundscapes is really lovely here. VROOOM: kicks all kinds of ass. This lineup really does a great job with VROOOM. Cage: pretty tight version, mostly Adrian of course.

Frying Pan: A very strong performance -- one of the best that I have heard of this song. Larks IV: Very good performance with lyrics. Again, Adrian is in good form, and the punchy little rhythmic thrakking at the beginning is crisp and clear on this recording. On the whole, possibly the best lyric-ful version I've heard.

Encores (full suite!):
3oaPP: The acoustic version. Adrian is in strong voice, though the Warsaw audience falls short in their duties ("complicated!" "aggravated!"). Thrush: This is a really sweet Thrush. The middle section with the angry, dissonant chords and RF doing the "dooEEEE" solos comes across really well. There were even better Thrushes in the 2003 tour, but this is one of the better ones currently available. SSEDD: Another very strong rendition. Not my favorite tune, but I like this performance. Heroes: well, we're pretty much all listening to hear Robert do that sweet sustained soloing, and he doesn't disappoint. Comparable to other KC versions on record, and again maybe a little better.

Summary: You pretty much know what to expect with this lineup and setlist, but particularly the second half of the concert is really well performed. Well worth picking up for fans of the TCOL-era band. If for some reason you haven't picked up Heavy ConstruKction, that's still the first recommendation, of course.
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Postby vrooom on Tue Jan 25, 2005 2:16 am

Thanks for that review - saves me the job. :D

Wonder when I'll get it. :?


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Postby Riverman on Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:13 am

I had a feeling I wouldn't want this one on top of the small heap of live Double Duo material I've got, so thanks for confirming it.
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Postby The Crimson Avenger on Tue Jan 25, 2005 4:07 pm

Riverman wrote:I had a feeling I wouldn't want this one on top of the small heap of live Double Duo material I've got, so thanks for confirming it.


At what strange pass have we arrived that a spanky live KC recording be so easily dismissed as redundant?

This is a judgement in which I concur, although I have ordered a copy because my completist soul must have the Improv. But the second disc may never grace my player.

If the KCCC was concieved in part to render bootleggers superfluous, that goal has largely been met.

I would never have thought it possible, but I have, almost, ENOUGH King Crimson (except for any new material that may erupt, of course, and recordings of a couple of concerts that I attended which struck me as special)

NEW RULE: Any further KCCC releases should be restricted to Improvs and previously unreleased songs/compositions.

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Postby Sebastian Knight on Tue Jan 25, 2005 4:40 pm

I don't regard this disk as redundant, but I know where you're coming from. It is pretty similar in setlist and quality, for example, to the London show on the EWO disk, or to the various performances on Heavy ConstruKction. On the other hand, I regard the recordings of Oyster Soup, Frying Pan, and Thrush to be amongst the very best on record. Oyster Soup and Frying Pan are both tracks that have occasionally been great live, but have been poorly served by most recordings. And while the Larks4 isn't going to replace the "Happy" version as my "reference recording", the punchy rhythms and a startling solo from Adrian both make it a truly fine rendition.

The other thing I think makes this disk interesting is precisely what (who) makes the best performances. It seems to me that the Rhythm Buddies were still in a state of transition. In P3, they were both absolutely key (all three members of P3 are), and having either Trey or Pat or both really on their game could really put the performance over the top. In 2000 Crim, I think they hadn't yet figured out how to operate in the Double Duo environment, and even if they were doing particularly fine work, it tended to get buried (except in the improvs and thrushes, which are basically ProjeKct work). By 2002 or so, they had transformed into the Rhythm Beasts, capable of propelling KC like a giant rocket engine.

So, for these 2000 concerts, it doesn't matter much if Pat and Trey are on (and both of them felt slightly off their game according to the diary). But in Warsaw that night, Adrian was having one hell of a great night. Trey may have been unhappy with Oyster Soup, since he was feeling lost and distracted, but Ade tears the roof off the joint. I'm not sure I've heard another performance from the Double Duo that made me feel that Adrian was the MVP in quite the same way. It's worth hearing.

As to the question of which KC is/isn't redundant at this point:
69: moot point. if any more is found, it's not redundant, and I'll buy it.
71: getting pretty redundant to me at this point.
72-74: You'd think some of this would be redundant, but not to me it isn't. I'm looking forward to Heidelberg. I'll download a bunch of this if/when the website happens.
80's: more from the early days would be particularly welcome, but I don't need that much more from the later albums. Say about 70% full at this point.
Double Trio: Not much interest from me, as most of the shows I have heard that are bootlegged sound pretty much like what I've heard officially.
Projekcts: more, please. P3 at Birchmere in 03 would be fun, more P4 would rule.
Double Duo: Yeah, 2000 is getting old, but the transition to the beastly version (around Level 5) needs more documentation, and I'd buy half a dozen 2003 recordings if I could.
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Postby vrooom on Tue Jan 25, 2005 4:59 pm

I buy because I am a fan-boy competist.

Though there's still plenty to hear from LTiA-era KC. But I would still like to hear more studio stuff...especially the Bearsville Sessions. :twisted: Maybe if Indy kisses Singleton's butt some more, it might just happen!


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Postby The Crimson Avenger on Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:24 pm

Sebastian Knight wrote:As to the question of which KC is/isn't redundant at this point:
69: moot point. if any more is found, it's not redundant, and I'll buy it.

Not of interest to me, and everything they've trotted out to date has been of heinous sound quality. If anything listenable is uncovered, Bring It On for the fans of this period.

71: getting pretty redundant to me at this point.


Yawn, anyway.

72-74: You'd think some of this would be redundant, but not to me it isn't. I'm looking forward to Heidelberg. I'll download a bunch of this if/when the website happens.


IMO, the songs are played out, but I say bring on as many Improvs as there may be.

80's: more from the early days would be particularly welcome, but I don't need that much more from the later albums. Say about 70% full at this point.


It would be lovely if a good recording of the Savoy shows surfaced, but the Discipline and Beat shows were fairly consistent from night to night. The Japan '84 video is relatively tame, and Absent Lovers burns pretty hot, but there was a stretch in June '84, where they were just Off The Hook. I should probably send a copy of the Minneapolils show to DGM. The recording is in the neighborhood of release quality.

Double Trio: Not much interest from me, as most of the shows I have heard that are bootlegged sound pretty much like what I've heard officially.


Agreed, but the November '95 Rochester NY show that I attended seemed Extra Special, and the tape bears it out. It would be nice if they had an ADAT of that night in the Foot Locker of Maximum Distress. Although On Broadway is an acceptable subsitute.

Projekcts: more, please. P3 at Birchmere in 03 would be fun, more P4 would rule.


IMO, P3 at Birchmere is the One Essential KCCC Release to Be. I have heard an execrable boot of it, and what I could discern amidst the murk was Truly Horrifying. I would buy the rest of the P1 material. I wouldn't scoff at more P4, but II have most of the P4 tour on CDR already and we're looking at diminishing returns. I think we have enough P2. The P3 tour of Austin was what, 3 gigs? So that's pretty much played.

Double Duo: Yeah, 2000 is getting old, but the transition to the beastly version (around Level 5) needs more documentation, and I'd buy half a dozen 2003 recordings if I could.


I'd love to see a compilation disc of the 2000 Improvs, and might buy another 2001 show. It seems to me that the 2003 shows were pretty much identical night to night, but would be happy to be proved wrong.
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Postby MarkSullivan on Tue Jan 25, 2005 6:51 pm

I've always had pretty limited interest in lots of live shows from any edition of the band--never joined the KCCC, and have only bought a few--so that's where I'm coming from. I want to hear New Stuff, so put me down for any collection of improvs. I agree with what's been said about the ProjeKcts. I love them, but I think it's pretty well covered. The impromptu P3 show would probably be interesting, since they must have been shaken out of their usual routines for that performance. It's possibly revealing that we still haven't heard a complete P1 gig. Did they really have so many brown spots that the only way to salvage anything was by editing? That is still a gap, anyhow; all the other ProjeKcts have had a full evening released.
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Postby Indyrod on Tue Jan 25, 2005 9:15 pm

I'll buy all the Larks era live stuff they put out, especially if it has Starless and Fracture, like the next KCCC (Heidelberg) does.

No more '69, '71, 80s, or Double Trio for me, I have more than enough.

I might be interested in another 2001-2003 live show since I missed the last tour, but I'm much more interested in the new stuff now.

I have no interest at all in the ProjeKcts, never have, never will, not my thing at all.
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Postby The Crimson Avenger on Tue Jan 25, 2005 11:34 pm

wIndyrod wrote:I have no interest at all in the ProjeKcts, never have, never will, not my thing at all.


And you act as some kind of meta-arbiter of taste on this board.

I think 'Lizards' is useless - that somehow makes me some kind of pariah, "not a 'real' KC fan". Yet you have no compunction about dismissing the most vital and interesting, if by definition not fully realized, period of work in the band's history.

You are nothing but a Basement Dweller. Why don't you take your Porcupine Tree lunchbox, your Queen albums, and your Italian splatterfest DVDs and go...anywhere else...

Apologies to the rest of you ProjeKctiles for my ill temper. If it weren't for this silly fellow, I would be a much more positive contributor.
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