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Favorite song from Court of the Crimson King

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Favorite song from Court of the Crimson King

21st Century Schizoid Man (including "Mirrors"
9
56%
I Talk to the Wind
2
12%
Epitaph (including "March for No Reason" and "Tomorrow and Tomorrow"
2
12%
Moonchild (including "The Dream" and "The Illusion"
0
No votes
The Court of the Crimson King (including "The Return of the Fire Witch" and "The Dance of the Puppets"
3
18%
 
Total votes : 16

Re: Favorite song from Court of the Crimson King

Postby Indyrod on Mon Jan 13, 2014 10:20 pm

jtmack wrote:
Maybe we could use this as the subject for anther poll. I think it would be who's album came out first using that tone.


not exactly sure what you mean by tone, Black Sabbath had their own tone and everything else. POINT!!!
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Re: Favorite song from Court of the Crimson King

Postby jtmack on Mon Jan 13, 2014 11:53 pm

King Crimson's album was released in 1969 and Black Sabbath's first 1970. Although Black Sabbath (a band I very much like in it's context) maybe were the first to play that style. Fripp may have been the first to record that guitar tone. Maybe Jimmy Page was first the to use that guitar tone on a album? It's what came first the chicken or the egg? The tone or the genre?
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Re: Favorite song from Court of the Crimson King

Postby Indyrod on Tue Jan 14, 2014 1:49 am

jtmack wrote:King Crimson's album was released in 1969 and Black Sabbath's first 1970. Although Black Sabbath (a band I very much like in it's context) maybe were the first to play that style. Fripp may have been the first to record that guitar tone. Maybe Jimmy Page was first the to use that guitar tone on a album? It's what came first the chicken or the egg? The tone or the genre?


what has me confused, is there are several definitions of "Tone", so just wanted to clarify it a bit. and even with the several definitions, I'm having a hard time connecting the two, especially as a Genre definition. so, just looking for YOUR definition we got working here. :?
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Re: Favorite song from Court of the Crimson King

Postby jtmack on Tue Jan 14, 2014 4:02 am

Indyrod wrote:
jtmack wrote:King Crimson's album was released in 1969 and Black Sabbath's first 1970. Although Black Sabbath (a band I very much like in it's context) maybe were the first to play that style. Fripp may have been the first to record that guitar tone. Maybe Jimmy Page was first the to use that guitar tone on a album? It's what came first the chicken or the egg? The tone or the genre?


what has me confused, is there are several definitions of "Tone", so just wanted to clarify it a bit. and even with the several definitions, I'm having a hard time connecting the two, especially as a Genre definition. so, just looking for YOUR definition we got working here. :?

Musical tone
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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A musical tone is a steady periodic sound. A musical tone is characterized by its duration, pitch, intensity (or loudness), and timbre (or quality).[1] The notes used in music can be more complex than musical tones, as they may include aperiodic aspects, such as attack transients, vibrato, and envelope modulation.
A simple tone, or pure tone, has a sinusoidal waveform. A complex tone is any musical tone that is not sinusoidal, but is periodic, such that it can be described as a sum of simple tones with harmonically related frequencies.[2]
Their guitar sound/tone is not a pure acoustic guitar sound their guitar tone/sound is heavily distorted which I believe stated a genre the way they used it...
:wink: Shit Indy now I'm getting confused!
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Re: Favorite song from Court of the Crimson King

Postby MarkSullivan on Tue Jan 14, 2014 6:56 am

I think it's that distorto fuzz guitar tone that made "21st Century Schizoid Man" jump out at the time. I've often heard it referred to as "proto-heavy metal," since that guitar sound became such a big part of metal, complete with the "power chords" Fripp used (actually not a chord at all, just an open fifth). But Black Sabbath featured that sound through the whole album, before the metal genre existed. I loved the first KC album, and I liked the first Black Sabbath album a lot too. I was a young guitarist who wanted to make rude noises like that!
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Re: Favorite song from Court of the Crimson King

Postby Indyrod on Tue Jan 14, 2014 10:00 pm

MarkSullivan wrote:I think it's that distorto fuzz guitar tone that made "21st Century Schizoid Man" jump out at the time. I've often heard it referred to as "proto-heavy metal," since that guitar sound became such a big part of metal, complete with the "power chords" Fripp used (actually not a chord at all, just an open fifth). But Black Sabbath featured that sound through the whole album, before the metal genre existed. I loved the first KC album, and I liked the first Black Sabbath album a lot too. I was a young guitarist who wanted to make rude noises like that!



according to a friend of mine on FB, "the first to use Fuzz and distortion on their guitars was "The Kinks" and Dave Davies". and their album came out in 1964 predating KC and Black Sabbath by several years. so how does that fit into the equation?

and several people agreed, all referring to the style of the guitar playing as a forerunner to Heavy Metal. with this as an example.

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Re: Favorite song from Court of the Crimson King

Postby Indyrod on Tue Jan 14, 2014 11:25 pm

""You Really Got Me" was an early hit song built around power chords (perfect fifths and octaves),and heavily influenced later rock musicians, particularly in the sub-genres heavy metal and punk rock. American musicologist Robert Walser wrote that it is "the first hit song built around power chords" while critic Denise Sullivan of Allmusic writes, "'You Really Got Me' remains a blueprint song in the hard rock and heavy metal arsenal."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/You_Really_Got_Me
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Re: Favorite song from Court of the Crimson King

Postby Krimzep on Wed Jan 15, 2014 3:08 am

To me The Kinks sound more like aluminum foil rather than heavy metal. They may have been the first to use those chords but they didnt have that rich, full powerful sound like Sabbath, Zeppelin, King Crimson.
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Re: Favorite song from Court of the Crimson King

Postby jtmack on Wed Jan 15, 2014 3:19 am

Krimzep wrote:To me The Kinks sound more like aluminum foil rather than heavy metal. They may have been the first to use those chords but they didnt have that rich, full powerful sound like Sabbath, Zeppelin, King Crimson.

Yes once again here comes that word tone. The sound the kinks use is more of a reverb sound than the heavily distorted sound of Black Sabbath or 21csm... Not to say that Kinks weren't rock innovators of sound and style and really original...
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Re: Favorite song from Court of the Crimson King

Postby MarkSullivan on Wed Jan 15, 2014 7:38 am

Indyrod wrote:""You Really Got Me" was an early hit song built around power chords (perfect fifths and octaves),and heavily influenced later rock musicians, particularly in the sub-genres heavy metal and punk rock. American musicologist Robert Walser wrote that it is "the first hit song built around power chords" while critic Denise Sullivan of Allmusic writes, "'You Really Got Me' remains a blueprint song in the hard rock and heavy metal arsenal."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/You_Really_Got_Me


I used to cover "You Really Got Me," and I always used full barre chords. I'm pretty sure that's the sound. Even that had precursors: think of "Louie Louie." That was a loud guitar, but it didn't have the kind of overdrive that Fripp used, or later metal bands. It certainly had a lot of attitude. But trying to fix origins like this is ultimately pointless. There's always something that came before, and it's just a matter of how far back you want to go.
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